Grammy® award winner Marvin Winans is a singer, songwriter, organist, pianist, preacher/pastor and actor. When Pastor Winans was invited to audition for Tyler Perry's latest film I Can Do Bad All By Myself, he was flattered and shocked, but ready to help his friend out. Of his preaching scene, Tyler Perry said that it was so anointed he chose not to cut anything from it, but to include it in its entirety in the finished film. I spoke with Pastor Winans about the film and his music the day the movie opened in theaters nationwide.

Pastor Winans, what was it like to watch yourself on the screen the other night during the premiere?

Pastor Winans:    It was a little scary. I don't like taking pictures of myself, so I didn't really look forward to seeing myself up there. But it was a great experience and I think the message got delivered. That's the most important thing.

Tyler told us that in one take, your message and song were so anointed that he left it as is. How much of that was scripted for you? Did he write it out or just give you the general idea?

Pastor Winans:     He told me to write the whole sermon and that's what I did. It was a sermon I had preached here before at Perfecting Church (Pastor Winans' church), and it just worked. It fit the character and we went with it. I just wish I had a hankie to wipe my face because I was sweating profusely.

How did you make the connection with Tyler to begin with?

Pastor Winans:     You know what's funny is that the Winans have been out here for so long. I've known Oprah for years. She came to Detroit to film our church. People ask me how I got Oprah to come out here, and I say, "What you people fail to realize is that back in the day, I was more famous than Oprah."

I actually met Oprah when she was in Baltimore and she filmed us because we had to do a play. She was working out of Baltimore and she was the person they sent out in the field. She was there to interview the Winans because she liked our music.

I think it was the same with Tyler. He liked our music and he called and asked if I would do this. I was like, "Tyler, come on, I'm not an actor." And he and Reuben Cannon (producer) told me they weren't going to let me fail. Obviously, they didn't.

Gladys Knight also talked about her collaboration with you and how much she enjoys working with you.

Pastor Winans:     We have done several things together and Gladys is just a sweetheart. Growing up here in Detroit, when you went into a restaurant, you could see Gladys Knight. When we met way back in the mid to early 80s, we met professionally, and she was someone you'd just long to work with. You'd think, "I would like for Gladys Knight to sing one of my songs." We collaborated on my brother Ronald Winans' Family and Friends album. She was so gracious as to come to sing, and we have a mutual love and respect for each other. It was a dream to come true. She can still sing. Oh, goodness!

Your careers have lasted so long. It seems now that someone's career and fame lasts about as long as it takes to make their first recording. What gives you staying power?

Pastor Winans:     The reason for the shortness of careers now is that the generation that is the hip-hop generation is that technology has ruined musicianship. You have folks that are considered artists that if you put a piece of music in front of them, they couldn't play it. Even though they're talented by ear, they don't master their craft. If you can put a couple of sounds and beats together, you're considered ready.

Even most of the top producers now can't play a song all the way through. So those artists don't have a foundation.

We paid our dues in a time when you learned how to be a singer and how to be a performer. I had the privilege of talking with Sammy Davis, Jr., a week before he passed. I was flying back to Los Angeles and he was on the plane to Chicago with me. When I got off, the person with him stopped me and said, "Mr. Winans, Mr. Davis would like to talk with you."

The cancer was in his throat and he didn't speak, but he mouthed to me that he loved me and loved my music. I was almost in tears. Here was a guy that I've seen almost all of my life as a complete package, from dance, to vocals, to acting. Most of the folk from that era were trained. I grew up in Motown when Motown was in Detroit, and they didn't allow groups to go on the road without being polished and trained. They taught them how to walk when they got off the bus and how to behave in public and do interviews. That is missing.

In the church here in Detroit, there was a time when we'd do five or six churches in a night, and what it did is that it made you so appreciative of your audience. It gave you a foundation, and that's the reason talent really lasts if there is talent and not just a quirk, or a hook, not just an inroad, but a real talent. With that training it will survive the years. That's the reason Gladys is still doing it.

And your family too.

Pastor Winans:     Yes, but I'm way younger than Gladys.

How old were you when you began doing music?

Pastor Winans:     When my mom first had us perform at a convocation or convention at our church, I was four years old. When we gave our first concert, I was 17. It was the first concert we made people pay $3 in advance and $3.50 at the door. I don't know what the extra $.50 did, but it was what you did during those days.

Did you know at that point that you were called to be a pastor?

Pastor Winans:     No, I never knew that I was called to be a pastor. I knew that I was called to preach, and I just prayed that I wouldn't preach until after I graduated from high school, and that's what happened.

But be called to preach? Oh, no. I didn't want to do that. Really, I didn't want to preach. I wanted to sing, write songs, travel, and be a Gospel artist that made everyone know the virtues, the values, the wonderful opportunity to hear the Gospel through song. That is absolutely all I wanted to do. Now look at me, I'm in a movie.

When did you realize God wanted you to be a pastor?

Pastor Winans:     Around 1983 or 84 I had a vision. I don't have many of those, but I certainly had a vision. In it, I saw people from around the world coming to me, and the Holy Spirit said, "They're coming to you."

I said, "No, no, please." But I wanted to have the presence of God, to know God. But the more I said "No," the more He left. But when I started saying "Yes," I felt His presence again, and I said, "Oh, man." So I knew then.

But I gave God a list of things He'd have to do if He wanted me to do this, and one day about six years later I was going to my car, not thinking about it, and the Lord said, "Ok, I've done everything you asked," and I said, "Ok, Lord, I'm going to do everything You ask."

In 1989 is when Perfecting Church started. We celebrate 20 years. We started with eight people, four of whom I clothed and fed, and now our membership is over 4,500 people, and it's a real number. We purge our membership rolls every month. Over 4,600 people call me pastor.

As a pastor, what do you do to keep your heart centered on the Lord and your faith grounded?

Pastor Winans:     I'm in prayer every Sunday morning at 6, every Tuesday morning at 6, and I live among my people. My definition of "famous" is a regular person that other regular people know about. It's not about me, it really isn't. Before I ever won a Grammy, I met Jesus. I didn't meet Jesus to win a Grammy. It's as He says in Matthew 6:33: "Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added." So this is just something that's added.

We never want to get our eyes off the prize, for what would it profit a man to gain the world and lose his soul? That's the reason we're able to stay grounded. Trust me, there's enough tribulation to keep me grounded. A lot of people see the glory but don't understand the story. I stay grounded in God knowing me, and knowing that without Him, I can't do any of the things I'm doing. And that's the truth, not just a catchy phrase.

Your children are very musical too, aren't they?

Pastor Winans:     Yes. As a matter of fact, I talked with Marvin, Jr., last night. He just returned from ministering in Ghana. It was his first time to Africa, and he and his wife were ecstatic. I'm really proud of them and what they're doing.

What's ahead for you next?

Pastor Winans:     I have a brand new praise and worship CD that's coming out. We're building a new edifice because our present one has grown too small and so we want to complete that in the next year. It will seat about 5000 in the city of Detroit.

We're also going to build homes and a community, and there's the Marvin L. Winans Academy that should be opening up in St. Louis not too far from now. We're just trying to reach people.

As the old song said, "I'm just a nobody trying to tell everybody about somebody that can save anybody." That's what we'll continue to do.

Photos courtesy Quantrell Colbert and LionsGate™ Entertainment.